SALON

Thursday, Oct 4, 2012 12:30 AM UTC

Debate fact check

Your comprehensive, real-time fact check of the first presidential debate

By

Topics: Mitt Romney, Barack Obama, Taxes, 2012 Elections, 2012 Presidential Debates, debate fact check,

Debate fact check (Credit: AP/Pablo Martinez Monsivais/Evan Vucci/Salon)

Tonight’s presidential debate will feature plenty of talk about the economy, healthcare and the role of government, but if it’s anything like every other political event ever anywhere, it will also feature plenty of exaggerations, mistruths and outright lies. We’ll be calling them out real-time and bring you the, you know, facts, so refresh this page often to stay up-to-date.

10:45 — Big Bird is tiny: Mitt Romney says he’d help bring down the deficit by cutting PBS and “Big Bird.” PBS receives about $445 million from the federal government, which represents about .01 percent of the federal budget.

10:20 — Romney left his heart in Zurich: Romney tells Obama, “The place you put your money is a pretty good indication of where your heart is.” The obvious rejoinder, ready-made for a DNC attack ad, is that Romney’s heart must be in the Cayman Islands, Bermuda or Switzerland, where Romney has put his money.

10:10 — “The same fucking bill”: Romney says his healthcare plan in Massachusetts is very different from Obamacare. The guy who designed both the plans calls them “the same fucking bill.”

10:00 — Romney sees death panels: Romney comes dangerously close to invoking death panels, saying Obamacare has “a board that will tell people what kind of treatment they’re going to get.” He’s referring to IPAB, a board of doctors, hospital officials and government officials who try to find best practices to reduce the cost of Medicare (and only Medicare — no one else’s healthcare — which is already a government plan). IPAB does not decide on individual cases, is subject to congressional oversight and is legally prohibited from rationing care. In August, Paul Ryan told Florida seniors Obamacare has a “rationing board.”

9:45 — Obamacare still doesn’t cut Medicare: Romney revived one of the most repeated falsehoods of the campaign – that Obamacare cut over $700 billion from Medicare. It’s not true, and Paul Ryan’s budget included the same cuts; Ryan and almost every other Republican in the House voted for them. Obamacare did cut funds from Medicare, but from providers, not beneficiaries. The actuaries in charge of the program say the savings will actually extend the life of the program and experts say the cuts won’t affect benefits.

9:40 — NFIB fib:  Romney uses as a cudgel against Obama’s tax plan a study from the National Federation of Independent Business. The NFIB sounds like an anodyne business group, but like the U.S. Chamber of Commerce it is actually a very partisan Republican group funded mostly by large corporations, not small businesses.

9:35 — Some small businesses not so small: Romney says Obama wants to raise taxes on “small businesses” by letting the Bush tax cuts on the top tier of income expire. Indeed, many small businesses pay taxes as if they’re individuals via companies called S-corporations. Many of these small business are mom-and-pop stores, home businesses, doctors offices, etc. – real small businesses. But some large privately held large corporations classify themselves as S-corps for tax purposes. For example, one “small business” registered this way: Koch Industries, the country’s second-largest privately held corporation.

 9:20 — Romney’s curious studies: Responding to Obama’s waving around the Tax Policy Center Study, Romney said there are five other studies that show he’s right. The problem with this is some aren’t studies (Wall Street Journal Op-Eds are not studies) and others are by economists advising his campaign.

9:15 – Romney still can’t explain his tax plan:  One of Mitt Romney’s core economic policies is a 20 percent tax cut for all Americans, which economists estimate will cost about $5 trillion over 10 years. Nonetheless, tonight Romney said,“I don’t have a $5 trillion tax cut.” What he means is that the net cost of his plan will be zero because he’ll find ways to raise $5 trillion to make up for lost revenue by closing loopholes and expanding the tax base. He wants “no tax cut that adds to the deficit,” as he said tonight. The problem with this is he won’t say how. In a much-cited study, the nonpartisan Tax Policy Center found that there’s no way this is possible without significantly raising taxes on the middle class, which Romney also says he’s not going to do.

The Romney campaign has disputed that study and others that came to similar conclusions, but has so far refused to offer details as to how they would pay for the tax cut. Paul Ryan said Sunday that it would take too long to explain the math. Romney came a little closer last night by saying he would cap deductions rich people could take by $17,000, but it’s still unclear that this would be enough to cover the cost of his plan.

Alex Seitz-Wald

Alex Seitz-Wald is Salon's political reporter. Email him at aseitz-wald@salon.com, and follow him on Twitter @aseitzwald. More Alex Seitz-Wald.

Next Article

Related Stories

More Related Stories

Featured Slide Shows

The week in 10 pics

close X
  • Share on Twitter
  • Share on Facebook
  • Thumbnails
  • Fullscreen
  • 1 of 11
  • Lisa Montgomery embraces her nephew Thursday after a tornado tore apart her home in Cleburne, Texas. The twister killed six people and destroyed entire swaths of the North Texas town.
    Credit: AP/LM Otero

  • Jack McMahon, the defense attorney for abortion doctor Kermit Gosnell, speaks outside the Criminal Justice Center in Philadelphia Tuesday. His client was convicted of killing three babies in his clinic, and will serve multiple life sentences.
    Credit: AP/Matt Rourke

  • A photo taken Monday captures Vice President Joe Biden's response to a Milwaukee second-grader's innovative proposal to end America's epidemic of gun violence. This guy!
    Credit: AP/Jenny Aicher

  • Sen. Rand Paul, R-Ky., flanked by a grouper-eyed Michele Bachmann, addresses the IRS' admission that it targeted Tea Party groups in advance of the 2012 election. In an op-ed for CNN Thursday, the Kentucky senator slammed the president for his faux outrage.
    Credit: AP/Molly Riley

  • Ousted IRS chief Steven Miller is sworn in on Capitol Hill Friday. Miller testified before the House Ways and Means Committee on the extra scrutiny the agency gave conservative groups applying for tax-exempt status.
    Credit: AP/J. Scott Applewhite

  • Attorney General Eric Holder pauses as he testifies on Capitol Hill before the House Judiciary Committee Wednesday. Holder is under fire, among other things, for the Justice Department's gathering of phone records at the Associated Press.
    Credit: AP/Carolyn Kaster

  • O.J. Simpson sits during an evidentiary hearing at Clark County District Court in Las Vegas, Nev., Thursday. Simpson, who is currently serving a nine-to-33-year sentence in state prison for armed robbery and kidnapping, is using a writ of habeas corpus to seek a new trial.
    Credit: AP/Las Vegas Review-Journal/Jeff Scheid

  • Major Tom to ground control: On Sunday astronaut Chris Hadfield recorded the first music video from space, a cover of David Bowie's "Space Oddity."
    Credit: AP/NASA/Chris Hadfield

  • When it rains it pours. President Barack Obama speaks during a news conference Thursday with Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan, inexplicably inspiring an #umbrellagate Twitter meme.
    Credit: AP/Jacquelyn Martin

  • A smoke plume rises high above a road block at the intersection of County A and Ross Road east of Solon Springs, Wis., Tuesday. No injuries were reported, but the the wildfire caused evacuations across northwestern Wisconsin.
    Credit: AP/The Duluth News-Tribune/Clint Austin

  • Recent Slide Shows

  • Share on Twitter
  • Share on Facebook
  • Thumbnails
  • Fullscreen
  • 1 of 11

Related Videos

Comments

 66 Comments

Comment Preview

Your name will appear as username

You may use these HTML tags and attributes: <a href=""> <b> <em> <strong> <i> <blockquote>

follow salon

Most Read

Popular on Reddit

links from salon.com

vote
FBI reportedly joins Bachmann campaign finance probe
237 points238 points | 15 comments
vote
Paul Krugman’s right: Austerity kills. "In an economy where we’re all in the same boat, one person’s spending is another person’s income. So when the government cuts spending, it reduces people’s income, leading to less business, more unemployment, and a vicious spiral of slowing down the economy."
228 points229 points | 199 comments
vote
Jon Karl makes things worse: He regrets “inaccurate” Benghazi email but says his story based on it “still entirely stands.” Really. ABC News?
207 points208 points | 31 comments
vote
“Jodorowsky’s Dune”: The sci-fi classic that never was.
80 points81 points | 16 comments
vote
Austerity Kills: Brian McArdle, a 57-year-old man who had had two strokes and could barely walk, was found "fit for work" by a government subcontractor, and had his benefits stopped. He died the next day.
57 points58 points | 3 comments

From Around the Web

Presented by Scribol
listener_new_rect The Listener: So long, Sookie Stackhouse

Recommendations