Mike Huckabee, on a wing and a prayer

The Pat Robertson endorsement [of Rudy Giuliani] happened today. You have other religious leaders who seem to be out of step with their religious voters. If you look at the straw polls, you win. At the Values Voter debate, you were overwhelmingly winning there. Why have you had such a difficult time winning over the leadership of these various organizations to get endorsements?

Well, I think that there is somewhat of a growing maturation of the movement. And as this movement matures, there is going to be a lot of people out there in grass roots who appreciate that I am not maybe a part of the establishment -- and they kind of like that -- and that I approach this by being true and unapologetic on the issues that have brought many of them to the conservative movement. Frankly, there is some of the questions about that that I can't answer. I can't understand it myself, other than, if I have to choose between having the leader or all their followers, I'll take their followers any day.

Are you saying that you think your approach to politics, your approach to values issues, is threatening to some of the old-time leaders?

I don't know. I hear that from others, that that is what some of the problem is, that I don't just toe the line.

On what issues? Are we talking taxes now, or are we talking other issues?

I think I am as clear on immigration as anybody. But because I also say, "Look, let's not just be angry at these people. Let's recognize that if we were them, we'd want to come here too." That's not amnesty. I'm not for amnesty. I'm not for sanctuary cities. I'm no liberal when it comes to that. I think I am almost as hard-line as, well I was going to say [Tom] Tancredo, but ... I think I am pretty adamant that we ought to obey the law. But my frustration with the immigration issue is not directed so much at desperate people as it is at a dysfunctional government.

If you won the nomination, could you have as your running mate a Republican who was pro-choice? And if you didn't win the nomination, could you be the running mate of a pro-choice Republican?

I'd have to really think and pray about that. You know, right now it is not an issue I have to face. I have a long way to go and many miles before that is going to be an issue for me. I certainly prefer someone who supports the platform of the party. But I don't want to make any categorical statements at this point ... We'll see how things shake out.

There is sort of a love-fest over the last few weeks among the national media for you. A number of columnists have written very flattering columns.

You must not have read John Fund.

I'm thinking of the more liberal columnists, I guess. The New York Times and Newsweek are giving you very flattering compliments. But if you look back at your history in Arkansas, you had a pretty rocky relationship with the media there.

Not with all of them.

With a certain portion of them.

It was almost like you can name three or four and, yes. But you don't have a very big universe to start with. I had a very good relationship with, I think, the editorial department of the Democrat-Gazette and with most of the people in the outlying press. There was a tabloid there that, goodness, I have never done anything right. And there are some of the columnists and some of the news people at the paper. But I had a great relationship with the broadcast press there. I don't know of any real problems there. That's true of any politician. If you are governor for as long as I was, you make enemies. That's part of the deal. You just inevitably tick some people off.

But there is nothing that us national media don't yet know about you that we are going to find out about, that is suddenly going to turn our relationship sour?

Michael, I mean, there will be things where you will say, Ah, I didn't know that. But I don't think there are any big bombs to land, because I mean, heck, all this stuff is out there already, whether it's stuff on everything from clemencies to taxes, accusations made about my personal behaviors. I mean all that stuff has been out there. But you have got to understand, it's hardball politics in Arkansas. And the ultimate thing is this, that I remained un-indicted for all those years is in itself an incredible accomplishment in my state. I often use the line that the five most feared words were "Will the defendant please rise." ... Here is what I would love for anybody to do: not just look at the stories but check the sources and run it to ground. But some of the stories, a lot of those ethics complaints were filed by the very newspaper columnists who then wrote the stories about it. You have to say, OK, now how objective is it if you file a complaint and then write a story about it and make a big deal, and then the other press picks up on it, and keeps repeating it as if it is some scandal. And some of it has the most simple explanations that takes a lot more than the 10 seconds to make the accusations, maybe 10 minutes to explain it. But I have never felt like, "Oh boy, if they ever dig into that I am like so, I am toast." I am honestly not worried about that. I'd be more worried that people just look at the headlines and not do their digging.

A good example, I mean John Fund's article, where he quoted Phyllis Schlafly -- who doesn't even live in my state -- in saying that I had left the Republican Party in shambles [in Arkansas]. And that was disappointing to read that, because I love Phyllis, still do -- think she is a wonderful lady. But I'm thinking, OK, when I became the lieutenant governor, I was the first Republican elected to statewide office in 16 years and only the fourth in history. And I was reelected with the largest margin of a Republican in the history of my state. Then I was governor and reelected twice. There were 11 [Republican] members of the House when I came in. There were 30 when I left. There were four senators. There were eight when I left. There were virtually no members of quorum courts and county offices. There were several when I left. I appointed hundreds, actually probably thousands, over the course of ten and a half years, to boards, commissions; hired them in agencies to run agencies. I mean it was OK to be a Republican by the time I left. My PAC that I created gave more money to Republican candidates than the state party did. I raised more money for the state party than anybody had ever done before. If that is in shambles, then gee.

One more question. Was it a mistake not to have a finance director in place until September, and are you confident now that you will have enough money for the Iowa caucuses to compete on the same level as Thompson, Giuliani, McCain and Romney?

Yeah, I think, we'll have enough money to be competitive. Here's the thing. We had a finance director early on -- freshly married, bought a house in Nashville, Tenn., and just couldn't make it work to try the commuting thing. And then we just had a tough time trying to find someone who wanted to move to Little Rock, somebody who had the experience at the national level. And part of our thing has been, people have said, you know if you do well down the road, we might come. But my obituary has been written every month since January. Everybody has assumed that, well, he won't make it another month. So people who might have come if they had known where we would end up, didn't. I think to me, the miracle of our campaign is, here we are after all these months of having everybody write us off every month: There is no way we are going to keep going. There is no way we are going to keep going. And I'm still here. In fact, I am going up. That's the good thing.

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